IRC Archive for channel #xwiki
Last modified by Vincent Massol on 2012/10/18 18:38
DSpair - (00:48): Quick question, I'm looking at the query guide, and I see how to write the query, but how do I iterate the results?
CalebJamesDeLisl - (00:51): It returns a list. You can use a for loop like: for (String name : results) {
DSpair - (00:52): OK, thanks!
DSpair - (00:55): OK, I tried to run my first query and I got "Failed to locate Script Service [query]"
DSpair - (00:55): Back to the docs.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (01:29): What was the command? Ping me when you have questions because I'm not always looking at irc.
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CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:13): I had a crazy idea, maybe all code should start out messy. If code starts out as one big method, then as it grows it gets broken off into other methods, then they become inner classes and finally the classes are promoted to .java files, no code ends up in production without multiple revisions and having been used, revised and used again.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:15): Code which has seen real use and been revised is less likely to have extension points which later on prove useless.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:17): Also if a coder doesn't think about extensibility and cleanliness until after the first prototype runs, the space of time between the eureka moment and running code is shorter.
vmassol - (09:20): I wouldn't like that…. :)
vmassol - (09:21): But
vmassol - (09:21): components are there to hide implementation details
vmassol - (09:21): and anything in the internal package is internal
vmassol - (09:21): so you're just talking about putting stuff internally first before exposing it
vmassol - (09:21): and this I agree
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:22): I write a lot of messy code, it never leaves my computer.
vmassol - (09:22): it's surely safer to open apis on need basis rather than too early
vmassol - (09:22): CalebJamesDeLisl: you can commit it in the sandbox :)
vmassol - (09:22): if you want to see messy code look at xwiki-core
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:22): I did :)
vmassol - (09:22): and look at how hard it is to maintain/evolve it
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:23): Something I noticed in xwiki-core was there were extension points which were never used so it's clear that the developer _tried_ to do it right.
vmassol - (09:24): there are ad-hoc extensions points everywhere
vmassol - (09:24): with hacks over hacks
vmassol - (09:24): to provide extensibility
vmassol - (09:24): and to take care of all use cases
vmassol - (09:24): but *without* having done any refactoring
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:24): I agree with you about apis, they are difficult to deal with.
vmassol - (09:24): as a consequence it's a big ball of mud
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:24): Yes, refactoring is key.
vmassol - (09:25): the key is the refactoring
vmassol - (09:25): yep
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:25): I am partial to the concept of spiral development I guess.
vmassol - (09:25): I also like iterative dev
vmassol - (09:26): but I don't see it as the opposite of clean dev
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:27): Well I see the problem with clean from the start development is that you don't know what you will need later so the developer tries to guess where extension points will be needed.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:28): My whole concept breaks down when multiple developers are working on the same piece of code (xwiki-core) because they are all afraid of breaking something.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:31): Something I find neat is how community development leads to modularity if for no other reason because nobody wants to break other people's code.
vmassol - (09:31): it's never clean from the start
vmassol - (09:31): but it can be thought out at a minimum level
vmassol - (09:31): you'll make mistakes anyway
vmassol - (09:32): but having cleaniness at heart will lead to better solution when you refactor the second time
vmassol - (09:32): and more importantly
vmassol - (09:32): it allows others to participate
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:33): Others are pretty well locked out until the code has undergone a few iterations.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:33): (in my model)
sburjan - (09:39): hello vmassol
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CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:49): Now that Dirtree has some semblance of stability, I'm doing stuff that I was putting off because it was a pain before. This is great. Now all I have to do is shorten the build time for XE.
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vmassol - (09:58): CalebJamesDeLisl: once you have something stable and you're happy with it, you could send a mail explaining it to others and see where to take it from there, maybe?
vmassol - (09:59): got to disconnect for 1 mn, brb
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silviar - (10:02): Hi! I have an issue if someone has a bit of time to look at it. I've added an application icon to the new invitation page http://code.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Applications/InvitationApplication; The issue is the icon will not show up in the bundled applications list on the Enterprise Features page http://enterprise.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Main/Features
silviar - (10:02): I think this has something to do with the fact that the new app page is in 2.0 Syntax
silviar - (10:02): as opposed to the other pages which are still in 1.0
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:03): Hmm. let me take a look. I wrote it.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:03): Nice icon.
silviar - (10:03): thanks
vmassol - (10:04): the image is missing the url for some reason
vmassol - (10:04): silviar: you have invitation.png
vmassol - (10:04): instead of the full url
vmassol - (10:04): let me check the other pages
vmassol - (10:05): yes that's why
vmassol - (10:05): you need a URL
vmassol - (10:05): I don't know if it's supported but it should be computed with velocity ideally
vmassol - (10:05): let me check if it works
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:06): Ahh yes, when I wrote the 2.0 version I was making it "so easy" by appending the content to "attack:"
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:06): s/attack:/attach:
silviar - (10:06): i've added the url, but the problem persists
silviar - (10:07): last time i fixed this by changing the page to 1.0 syntax for the annotations app page
vmassol - (10:07): silviar: nope
vmassol - (10:07): :)
vmassol - (10:07): it's fixed
vmassol - (10:07): it's just that this page has a cache
silviar - (10:07): ok :)
silviar - (10:07): so that was it
vmassol - (10:07): to refresh pages with a cache you need to suffix the url with ?refresh=1
silviar - (10:07): thanks
vmassol - (10:08): CalebJamesDeLisl: hmmm not much we can do to prevent having to put a full URL right now
vmassol - (10:08): since attach will only support absolute URL FTM
vmassol - (10:08): so using $xwiki.getDocument(…).getURL(…) will not work
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:09): I think the fix is going to break the other page until someone changes the classSheet
vmassol - (10:09): silviar: don't change pages to 1.0 syntax!
vmassol - (10:10): we want the opposite :)
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:10): Ok, I used "image:" so it still works with the full URL. Good.
silviar - (10:11): yes, i know :)
sburjan - (10:12): Does anybody have any Idea when the multilanguage problem will be fixed ? the one that shows all available languages even if the user enabled 3
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:13): hah, I capitalize Idea too.
vmassol - (10:13): sburjan: nobody expressed interest so far in fixing this AFAIK
vmassol - (10:15): CalebJamesDeLisl: some failing tests for you: http://hudson.xwiki.org/job/xwiki-product-enterprise-tests/com.xpn.xwiki.products$xwiki-enterprise-test-ui/990/testReport/
vmassol - (10:15): hmm sergiu hasn't fixed the object editor yet
vmassol - (10:15): :(
vmassol - (10:16): another day lost for the release
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:16): That looks like the flicker we were talking about. Seems to be disrupting the state.
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tmortagne - (10:16): vmassol: yep i can't see him connected since he said he would fix them
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:17): Maybe I can try to detect a page load.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:17): Broken fiber strikes at the worst moments...
vmassol - (10:18): broken fiber is better than no fiber at all! :)
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:18): I don't have any fiber but I live in the woods and when a fiber breaks nobody reports it for a week.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:18): (the backhaul fiber for the town)
tmortagne - (10:19): vmassol: i reduced the validity test to only inline style related failures that will can't be easily fixed without some refactoring but are very minor so that would be ok for the release
vmassol - (10:20): tmortagne: ok, what's the plan after the release? We enable them again? We'll need to decide who fixes them
sburjan - (10:20): how can a fiber break ?
vmassol - (10:20): sburjan: put an elephant on it
vmassol - (10:20): :)
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:21): or a tree branch. Or an incompetent backhoe operator.
tmortagne - (10:21): vmassol: i don't plan to disable them, they should be blocker for the RC
sburjan - (10:21): i know optic-fiber is buried
vmassol - (10:21): tmortagne: oh ok, I understood wrongly your message
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:21): Not in my town, it runs along the phone lines.
sburjan - (10:22): i understand
tmortagne - (10:22): vmassol: i said it's ok to release a milestone with them because they are minor but i don't need to disable anything to release
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:22): In my town you can't dig 6 inches without hitting a rock.
sburjan - (10:23): where do you live ?
tmortagne - (10:23): there is only one that will probably impossible to fix and that we will disable i guess: that's the incitation one that needs to be inline because of mails
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:23): woods
sburjan - (10:28): vmassol : when you have 5 minutes to finish the yesterday's topic please tell me :)
vmassol - (10:29): sburjan: don't wait for me
vmassol - (10:29): just ask your questions
vmassol - (10:29): but don't ask them to me
vmassol - (10:29): ask them to the community
vmassol - (10:29): whoever is free and has the answer will answer
sburjan - (10:29): ok. i'll try to be as short as possible. This is a question for everybody anyway.
vmassol - (10:30): just to be clear, there's nobody in charge of xwiki.org
vmassol - (10:30): I'm not in charge for ex
sburjan - (10:30): We have some portion of documentation that aren;t accessible from nowhere. There are certain pages that only accessible if you know the URL, but from the interface they are inaccessible.
sburjan - (10:31): i know, but you're one of the few who actually respond to my dilemmas
sburjan - (10:31): *isn't
vmassol - (10:31): sure but I'd like others to answer too
sburjan - (10:31): me too
vmassol - (10:31): so if you ping me nobody else will answer
vmassol - (10:31): :)
sburjan - (10:31): :)
vmassol - (10:32): what page? can you give an ex?
sburjan - (10:32): now
sburjan - (10:32): http://code.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Applications/WatchlistApplication
sburjan - (10:32): go to : Viewing the elements in your watchlist
sburjan - (10:32): on the bottom
sburjan - (10:32): you'll see there a screenshot with Remove from watchlist
sburjan - (10:33): that screen isn;t accessible from nowhere, but only if you know the URL
vmassol - (10:33): I think that screenshot is old now
vmassol - (10:33): since the watchlist is now in the user's profile
vmassol - (10:33): no?
sburjan - (10:33): but the "interface" is still there
sburjan - (10:33): yes
tmortagne - (10:33): sburjan: are you sure ? wathlist is supposed to be accessible in user profile
sburjan - (10:33): it is accessible from user profile
sburjan - (10:34): but you can.t delete nothing from there
vmassol - (10:34): sburjan: the UI is different now so the image will need to be updated
sburjan - (10:34): onlyUNwatch
vmassol - (10:34): sburjan: indeed it's a bug
vmassol - (10:34): jvdrean: any idea?
vmassol - (10:34): (jvdrean is the one who did it)
sburjan - (10:34): it's not a bug.. we changed the UI in thea meantime.. but forgot to actually delete the old functionality
vmassol - (10:34): entering call now, bbl
sburjan - (10:34): okay
sburjan - (10:35): so as far as I see, nowdays we don't telede the watch on a space, page, wiki, we click on the unwatch button
tmortagne - (10:35): sburjan: something that should not be here is a bug ;)
sburjan - (10:35): and this oldscreen + still existingfunctionality has remained
sburjan - (10:39): I mean... it's like we have multiple UI's .. but only one of them is viewable, the others are like hidden easter eggs :)
sburjan - (10:40): the problem would be that is they will coexist .. maybe they could break functionality and become some sort of exploits
sburjan - (10:40): and can't be found when testing
tmortagne - (10:41): sburjan: again this does not looks like something done on purpose and everyone agree that it's bad to have old lost UIs duplicating new UIs
tmortagne - (10:43): sburjan: jvdrean is looking at it (can't answer right now)
jvdrean - (10:44): looking at it, indeed there's a page that should have been removed a while ago
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jvdrean - (10:48): lucaa: looks like the annotations menu entry doesn't like the use of the watch entry next to it
lucaa - (10:48): hi jvdrean
lucaa - (10:49): it's the other way around :) watch menu is refreshing the whole menu when it's changed
sburjan - (10:49): okay, so I should issue a Major bug on JIRA ?
jvdrean - (10:49): is there a jira about this ?
jvdrean - (10:49): sburjan: I'll handle it
lucaa - (10:49): what bug are you referring?
sburjan - (10:49): okay jvdrean
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sburjan - (10:52): okay. so I have a go to remove the documentation that reffers to the lost UI ?
jvdrean - (10:53): sburjan: yes please, the 'Viewing the elements in your watchlist' paragraph must be removed
sburjan - (10:54): ps: this is present also on xwiki.org
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CalebJamesDeLisl - (11:05): So are there any opinions on whether the invitation app should be linked from other places and if so where?
CalebJamesDeLisl - (11:05): On the one hand, if it's not set up then linking it to the user pages or some place will confuse users when it doesn't work.
silviar - (11:06): jvdrean: I actually found the watchlist hidden page while fixing the notifications page on xwiki.org, otherwise we may not have noticed it; for the watch & annotations issue i filed this bug some time ago XAANNOTATIONS-9 ; feel free to move it to watchlist app if you think that's where it should go
CalebJamesDeLisl - (11:07): On the other hand, that's the way the watchlist app works and it's linked from the user pages even if it doesn't work.
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jvdrean - (11:09): CalebJamesDeLisl: wdym?
CalebJamesDeLisl - (11:09): If no mail relay is set up, users can still access the watchlist.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (11:10): Asking is that how invitation should be (see post before Silvia's)
jvdrean - (11:10): (computer slow has hell, I didn't see your previous messages at first)
CalebJamesDeLisl - (11:12): I could put it in the user dropdown menu under profile, preferences, watchlist.
sburjan - (11:13): CalebJamesDeLisl, : have you separeted failed messages from the other ?
CalebJamesDeLisl - (11:13): Nah, getting there...
CalebJamesDeLisl - (11:14): Seems logical to separate accepted messages, and declined messages etc. So it will be a redesign of the page.
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CalebJamesDeLisl - (11:22): How did saving ram in the velocity macros go? Were any changes made to the cache?
tmortagne - (11:29): CalebJamesDeLisl: vmassol fixed it, the change is that the cache is cleaned at the end of the page rendering process now
CalebJamesDeLisl - (11:30): So it doesn't clean when #includeForm is called?
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tmortagne - (11:32): no
tmortagne - (11:32): (no it does not)
sburjan - (11:42): who created the ColorTheme App ?
sburjan - (11:43): I have a question. I am able to change the ColorTheme from the Administration Panel, but I can;t change the ColorTheme from AdministerSpace. The field isn't there anymore. Is this normal behaviour ?
sburjan - (11:45): I can change the skin for a space (eg. put Toucan) .. so I should be able to change ColorThemes in Colibri too
tmortagne - (11:47): sburjan: i think it's not supported at space level or something
sburjan - (11:47): so only skin change is supported at space level ?
sburjan - (11:48): okay
sburjan - (11:49): another issue is .. does XWiki support user level skin change ? I found a document that states this, but I am unable to do ti
tmortagne - (11:49): (not 100% sure, sdumitriu would know better)
sburjan - (11:49): *i
sburjan - (11:49): okay
tmortagne - (11:49): user level skin change is not supported no AFAIK
sburjan - (11:50): thanks. I'll correct the docs
tmortagne - (11:50): (but again not the expert, simply never heard of that)
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CalebJamesDeLisl - (12:20): What can you do with XWQL that you can't to with hibernate?
tmortagne - (12:46): CalebJamesDeLisl: most important thing is that you write query supposedly independent from the storage
tmortagne - (12:47): now i doubt you can do things with XWQL impossible with hibernate, since the query is converted to hibernate query
CalebJamesDeLisl - (12:47): Been playing with it a little, I can write most of the hql language into the xwql parser so I'm not sure if that's a realistic expectation.
tmortagne - (12:47): CalebJamesDeLisl: artem tested XWQL with JCR
tmortagne - (12:48): which is completely different
CalebJamesDeLisl - (12:48): I would be +1 for it if there was a nice way to (for instance) get an object property value.
tmortagne - (12:48): CalebJamesDeLisl: i don't know XWQL very well but it's supposed to be easier to write than hql
tmortagne - (12:49): things you probably can't do with XWQL are join i guess
vmassol - (12:49): tmortagne: really?
CalebJamesDeLisl - (12:49): The problem with JCR testing is proving that you can't craft an xql query which will not work on jcr.
vmassol - (12:49): why not?
CalebJamesDeLisl - (12:50): No I just did a join.
vmassol - (12:50): XWQL is a superset of JPQL
vmassol - (12:50): so all JPQL stuffare supported
tmortagne - (12:50): vmassol: no idea, it's just that it's generally the last thing supported and i don't think JCR support that
vmassol - (12:50): it's not JCR
vmassol - (12:50): this is not JCR
tmortagne - (12:50): vmassol: i know
tmortagne - (12:50): it's not what i said
vmassol - (12:50): "things you probably can't do with XWQL are join i guess"
vmassol - (12:50): was just answerng to that
tmortagne - (12:50): there is an JCR based imprementation
tmortagne - (12:50): which is supposed to support XWQL
vmassol - (12:51): really?
vmassol - (12:51): I didn't know that
tmortagne - (12:51): yes and you did not understand what i said
tmortagne - (12:51): that was one of the main goal
tmortagne - (12:51): having a common language for several implementations
tmortagne - (12:52): now i don't know how far artem could go on JCR implementation
CalebJamesDeLisl - (12:52): What happens if users write queries (say for instance with joins) and then we switch to jcr and those queries break because fundamentally they are HQL?
tmortagne - (12:52): CalebJamesDeLisl: i'm not even sure it's not supported by JCR but i think i remember something about that
tmortagne - (12:53): but i gues if we have time and workforce for it in that case we would have to emulate
CalebJamesDeLisl - (12:54): I see no way of proving that every XWQL->HQL query will work with XWQL->JCR.
vmassol - (12:54): JCR has its own query API
vmassol - (12:54): and JCR implementation have to support some query languages
vmassol - (12:54): xpath, sql in jcr 2.0
vmassol - (12:55): now some JCR implementation should allow you to plug your own language implementation
vmassol - (12:55): but this remains to be seen
vmassol - (12:55): I couldn't find out how to do that easily with jackrabit for ex
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vmassol - (12:55): (I didn't look too long though, was just looking for a way to replace the jackrabbit query engine with ours)
CalebJamesDeLisl - (12:56): Another complaint about XWQL is the error messages. "expecting from, id"
tmortagne - (12:57): AFAICS we only have XWQLtoHQLTranslator for now
CalebJamesDeLisl - (12:58): So it's not even proven that XWQL _can_ be translated to JCR.
tmortagne - (12:58): so no JCR support
tmortagne - (12:59): i think that's why i remember something about Artem waiting for JCR2
CalebJamesDeLisl - (12:59): I like the idea of an XWiki query manager.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (13:01): IMO the perfect query manager would take the place of hibernate or jcr and interface with jdbc.
vmassol - (13:01): CalebJamesDeLisl: you mean a XWIKI JCR query manager?
vmassol - (13:02): (because otherwise we already have a xwiki query manager)
CalebJamesDeLisl - (13:03): I am worried that jcr would not perform well. Everything in one table, sounds like bad news.
vmassol - (13:03): JCR doesn't say that.It depends on implementations
vmassol - (13:03): the pb with a xwiki jcr query manager is that the JCR specs doesn't say anything about plugging your own implementation
vmassol - (13:04): CalebJamesDeLisl: there are 2 differents things to understand
vmassol - (13:04): 1) using the JCR API
vmassol - (13:04): 2) using an existing JCR implementation
CalebJamesDeLisl - (13:04): What are the advantages of JCR?
vmassol - (13:04): your code is independent of the underlying storage and standard
vmassol - (13:04): standard = you can change the underlying engine
CalebJamesDeLisl - (13:05): Well actually it's dependent on JCR standard.
vmassol - (13:05): JCR is a standard and it's generic for any content app
tmortagne - (13:05): I guess that's the mail that made me remember something about JCR 2/query manager: http://markmail.org/message/o77ki3skmmpvpjgs
CalebJamesDeLisl - (13:06): And some vendors will add optional features which we must avoid in order to be compatable, just like SQL.
vmassol - (13:06): CalebJamesDeLisl: you really need to have a look at what JCR
vmassol - (13:06): provides
vmassol - (13:06): it's 100 times better than what we ahve
vmassol - (13:07): I started listed the advantages for us on the new model design page
vmassol - (13:07): and I'm only talking about standard jcr
vmassol - (13:07): not anything optional
CalebJamesDeLisl - (13:07): I read up on it a bit. The text was talking about the choice between jcr and subversion which is not very encouraging from a performance perspective.
vmassol - (13:07): JCR is like JDBC if you prefer
vmassol - (13:08): before JDBC you could still DB queries
vmassol - (13:08): s/Still/still do/
vmassol - (13:08): I think I put some links in the deisng page
CalebJamesDeLisl - (13:08): Without jdbc each db would need a different driver api correct?
vmassol - (13:09): yes
vmassol - (13:09): lunch time!
CalebJamesDeLisl - (13:09): coffee time.
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vmassol - (13:31): still no sergiu….
vmassol - (13:37): guys seems there's a new version of selenium2
vmassol - (13:37): http://repo2.maven.org/maven2/org/seleniumhq/selenium/selenium/2.0a4/
vmassol - (13:38): I'm proposing to upgrade
vmassol - (13:38): ok?
tmortagne - (13:38): +1
vmassol - (13:38): I'll run some tests locally with it first
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vmassol - (13:45): I still get errors…. our tests are really bad I think since I always get lots of errors when I execute them locally
vmassol - (13:45): several are missing setting up preconditions
vmassol - (13:47): + even more important the flickering
vmassol - (13:48): I think this is not correct:
vmassol - (13:48): public void clickSaveAndContinue()
vmassol - (13:48): {
vmassol - (13:48): saveandcontinue.click();
vmassol - (13:48): }
vmassol - (13:48): we need to wait for the save to have been done I think
vmassol - (13:48): this is one causing flickering
vmassol - (13:48): I'll try to fix it
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DSpair - (13:54): Good morning all.
DSpair - (13:55): Quick question. I created a new class called "Circuit". I added several object of that class type to a document. I then added a livetable to that document and got the following message and only one row of results : The environment prevents the table to load data.
DSpair - (13:56): Wait one, I found a mailing list post about this error.
DSpair - (14:00): OK, I imported the updated version of LiveTable application and now I don't get an error, but I also don't get any data displayed.
vmassol - (14:13): js guys, any idea why the following doesn't work for save&continue:
vmassol - (14:13): waitUntilElementIsVisible(By.xpath("//div[@class='xnotification-done' and text()='Saved'"));
vmassol - (14:13): I also tried with:
vmassol - (14:13): waitUntilElementIsVisible(By.xpath("//div[@class='xnotification-done']"));
vmassol - (14:17): this one seems to work though:
vmassol - (14:17): waitUntilElementIsVisible(By.className("xnotification-done"));
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:19): you can do that in an xpath?
vmassol - (14:19): CalebJamesDeLisl: what part?
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:20): and text()... looks wrong
vmassol - (14:20): yes that one might not work
vmassol - (14:20): I wasn't sure of myself
vmassol - (14:20): but the other one should have worked
vmassol - (14:20): no?
vmassol - (14:20): unless it's not a div
vmassol - (14:20): but the js source seems to suggest it is
vmassol - (14:20): this.element = new Element("div", {"class" : "xnotification xnotification-" + this.type}).update(this.text);
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:21): Also if it's multiple class names.
vmassol - (14:21): hmm right
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:21): class="class1 class2"
vmassol - (14:21): that might be it
vmassol - (14:21): trying
vmassol - (14:22): indeed
vmassol - (14:22): waitUntilElementIsVisible(By.xpath("//div[contains(@class,'xnotification-done')]"));
vmassol - (14:22): works
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:22): hmm, didn't know about that one.
vmassol - (14:22): btw
vmassol - (14:23): this works too now
vmassol - (14:23): waitUntilElementIsVisible(By.xpath("//div[contains(@class,'xnotification-done') and text()='Saved']"));
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:23): Interesting. I must have missed the lower half of the xpath spec.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:25): I read your page about JCR. Versioning is very nice. Still no language integration of queries, unfortunately.
vmassol - (14:26): regarding xpath
vmassol - (14:26): I was told to avoid it as much as possible in selenium2
vmassol - (14:26): because the xpath engine on IE is awfully slow
vmassol - (14:26): at some point we might want to replace them with other chained By
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:27): I have been avoiding xpath because it just seems like it would be slow. Are we planning IE testing?
vmassol - (14:27): re IE yes
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:28): Good. Releasing with IE bugs was not cool.
vmassol - (14:28): CalebJamesDeLisl: is that what you mean: http://www.day.com/specs/jcr/2.0/6_Query.html ?
vmassol - (14:28): JCR-JQOM
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:29): Query createQuery(java.lang.String statement, java.lang.String language)
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:30): Same old query method = same old "select something where this = '" + sqlInjection + "'";
vmassol - (14:30): I don't read it this way
vmassol - (14:30): "JCR-JQOM (JCR Java Query Object Model), which expresses a query as a tree of Java objects."
vmassol - (14:32): ah here's an ex:
vmassol - (14:32): http://dev.day.com/discussion-groups/content/lists/cq-google/2010-03/2010-03-24__day_communique_CQ5_3_how_to_create_queries_with_JQOM_Thomas_Amsler.html/4?sort=date&q=jcr
vmassol - (14:33): hmm not very good ex
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:35): This looks promising: http://www.day.com/maven/javax.jcr/javadocs/jcr-2.0/index.html
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:36): No this http://www.day.com/maven/javax.jcr/javadocs/jcr-2.0/javax/jcr/query/qom/package-summary.html
vmassol - (14:36): yes
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:37): I still want to see a real query. Linq is ok but not that intuitive.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:38): Seen more broken websites looking for this than in the past week.
vmassol - (14:41): ok 9 more false positives tests to fix….
vmassol - (14:41): CalebJamesDeLisl: are you fixing this one:
vmassol - (14:41): java.lang.AssertionError: LiveValidation did not show a failure message but clicking on the register button did.
vmassol - (14:41): ?
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:41): I'm not sure what to do with that.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:42): Stop testing liveValidation?
vmassol - (14:42): make it work?
DSpair - (14:42): LOL
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:42): return true; ;)
vmassol - (14:42): these are failing locally for me: http://tinycoke.com/_6rsuAVrtncELU/screen_shot_2010-06-24_at_2.41.55_pm.png
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:43): I havn't seen that many fail on my machine.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:44): running...
vmassol - (14:44): I have a build from yesterday morning I think
DSpair - (14:46): Wanted to let you know, in the next few days I will have completed my new application for XWiki. It's called InfrastructureBackup and it allows you to add a list of Cisco/HP/Nortel/etc... devices which it will then automatically log into via telnet/SSH and capture the running configuration and back it up as an attachment.
DSpair - (14:46): I'll submit it for public use to wherever you would like me to put it.
sburjan - (14:46): guys, who crafted the PhotoAlbum App ?
DSpair - (14:46): I should say "I'll have finished the first version"
florinciu - (14:47): sburjan: JV and Jerome I think
DSpair - (14:48): Right now it uses ExpectJ and calls to "exec()" to run local copies of ssh/telnet. The next version I will integrate Jsch for SSH and use sockets for Telnet.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:48): That's great! Applications go on code.xwiki.org
tmortagne - (14:50): CalebJamesDeLisl: you can close XAADMINISTRATION-140 since there is no XHTML validity issues in admin app anymore
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:51): Yes, thanks for pointing that out. Should I assign you?
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:52): Actually we all put some work into that one.
tmortagne - (14:52): CalebJamesDeLisl: your are the only one having done commit associated to this issue ;)
tmortagne - (14:52): assign to you
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:52): Ok, credit I can take.
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tmortagne - (14:56): CalebJamesDeLisl: same for http://jira.xwiki.org/jira/browse/XAADMINISTRATION-139
DSpair - (14:59): I just downloaded XEclipse and it won't run. Is the Linux version only good on 32bit?
CalebJamesDeLisl - (15:00): Hmm I still see a few failures.
tmortagne - (15:00): CalebJamesDeLisl: not on admin app
tmortagne - (15:00): let me re-check
tmortagne - (15:00): CalebJamesDeLisl: there is annotation, invitation and editors
tmortagne - (15:01): so nothing related to xwiki-application-administration project
CalebJamesDeLisl - (15:01): I see so that's because you changed the rules?
tmortagne - (15:02): what rules are you talking about ?
tmortagne - (15:02): i fixed lots of test (and remove PanelWyzard test) but i did not changed anything
CalebJamesDeLisl - (15:02): Ok.
tmortagne - (15:03): s/fixed lots of test/fixed lots of failure/
CalebJamesDeLisl - (15:06): Did you commit on any issue when you fixed the tests?
tmortagne - (15:07): CalebJamesDeLisl: was generally "[misc] Fix Dutch Web Guidelines validity issues" i was a bit lazy on that but i mostly fixed templates if i remember well, if i fixed admin app page it was a very few
tmortagne - (15:08): (and "[misc] Fix XHTML validity issues")
CalebJamesDeLisl - (15:08): Hmm, no commits on that issue and it's fixed.
tmortagne - (15:08): checking
tmortagne - (15:09): CalebJamesDeLisl: maybe you fixed them in some other committs
tmortagne - (15:10): i don't see any commit from me on admin app since the previous release
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CalebJamesDeLisl - (15:10): I guess I'll call it a dupe of the XHTML issue.
tmortagne - (15:11): yep maybe you fixed theses issue with the XHTML issues yes
tmortagne - (15:11): CalebJamesDeLisl: XAADMINISTRATION-149
tmortagne - (15:12): that was a XHTML issue too
tmortagne - (15:12): so you probably committed in theses one
CalebJamesDeLisl - (15:12): Ahh, thanks.
tmortagne - (15:12): anyway, if there was anything you fixed it ;)
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sburjan - (16:08): I get this warning in the console when running the latest snapshot
sburjan - (16:08): 2010-06-24 17:03:22,814 [http://localhost:8080/xwiki/bin/edit/UNREGISTEREDuserSPACE/WebHome?parent=&template=&title=UNREGISTEREDuserSPACE] WARN internal.DefaultVelocityEngine - Deprecated usage of getter [com.xpn.xwiki.api.Document.getSyntaxId] in /templates/macros.vm@2341,54
sburjan - (16:08): I only created a new space
vmassol - (16:08): sburjan: we're fixing those, this is a just a warning so don't worry
sburjan - (16:09): I;m worried about everything that looks a bit suspicious
vmassol - (16:09): sburjan: yes that's good
sburjan - (16:10): so these warns will be fixed in M2 ?
vmassol - (16:10): yes
sburjan - (16:10): okay
sburjan - (16:11): also I get A LOT of these when logging off/in
sburjan - (16:11): 2010-06-24 17:10:41.045::WARN: java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Cookie name "XWiki.Admin_Panels.Recently Modified" is a reserved token
vmassol - (16:11): that one isn't normal
vmassol - (16:11): never seen it
sburjan - (16:12): these aren't logged in xwiki.log
sburjan - (16:12): they are spat directly in the terminal
vmassol - (16:13): whatever goes on the terminal also go in xwiki.log
vmassol - (16:14): (unless you've modified the default logging config but I doubt that)
vmassol - (16:14): ah maybe they're not coming from xwiki
sburjan - (16:14): oddly, these aren't in my xwiki.log . running latest snapshot, default all
vmassol - (16:14): in which case they'll go in other log files
vmassol - (16:15): hmm
vmassol - (16:15): another option is that whoever sends those don't use the xwiki log system
vmassol - (16:15): you don't have more details?
sburjan - (16:16): well .. in order to reproduce
sburjan - (16:16): I start either start_xwiki.sh or start_xwiki_debug.sh ...
sburjan - (16:17): click on Run In Terminal
sburjan - (16:17): so I get a terminal windows opened as long as xwikis erver is running
sburjan - (16:17): and this is the place where I get these
vmassol - (16:17): anyway that's not the issue
vmassol - (16:17): how do I reproduce?
sburjan - (16:18): how I said above
sburjan - (16:18): i get a few when logging in, a few when logging out
vmassol - (16:18): so you get those at startup even when you don't touch the xwiki app?
sburjan - (16:18): let me try
vmassol - (16:18): ahah
vmassol - (16:18): so you log in
vmassol - (16:18): you didn't say that before
sburjan - (16:18): i log in
vmassol - (16:19): can you verify?
vmassol - (16:19): that you get them all the time
sburjan - (16:19): when starting xwiki clean.. without touching nothing, not even a refresh I don't get it
vmassol - (16:19): I don't get why we're putting the name of a page in a cookie though
sburjan - (16:19): I get it when simply refreshing the page
sburjan - (16:20): again when hitting the log In button
sburjan - (16:20): again when hitting the Log out button
sburjan - (16:20): i have a clue why we do that
vmassol - (16:20): to redirect back to the page after logging?
sburjan - (16:21): because when you log off, i saw that xwiki has the tendency to leavy you on the same page you were on when you hit logoff, instead ofredirecting to the main page
sburjan - (16:21): yes
sburjan - (16:21): exactly
sburjan - (16:21): but i'm not a tech guy yet, so I don;t know what happens before
vmassol - (16:21): what servlet container are you using, jetty?
sburjan - (16:21): yes, standard jetty, latest snapshot take from mave.xwiki.org ...
sburjan - (16:21): *taken
sburjan - (16:22): these lines aren'tsaved in xwiki.log
sburjan - (16:22): i triple checked
sburjan - (16:23): what could I do more in order to help figure it out ?
vmassol - (16:23): nothing FTM
vmassol - (16:23): except report it
vmassol - (16:23): in jira
vmassol - (16:25): it's possible sergiu introduced the pb in rev 28709
sburjan - (16:25): wait till silviar confirms too
vmassol - (16:25): when fixing "XWIKI-5156: Session cookies are not marked as HttpOnly"
vmassol - (16:26): maybe response.addCookie was escaping chars
vmassol - (16:26): while the new method he's used odesn't
sburjan - (16:27): maybe my browser or cache or cookies have something
sburjan - (16:27): let me cleamall
sburjan - (16:30): it was my browser's cookies
sburjan - (16:30): something messed them up. I officially apologize
vmassol - (16:31): yes sergiu's code does use quoted string:
vmassol - (16:32): cookieValue.append("\"" + cookie.getValue() + "\"");
vmassol - (16:32): so special chars hsould be ok
vmassol - (16:32): I still odn't understand how you could have such invalid cookies
sburjan - (16:32): i'm special :)
vmassol - (16:32): seems the pb is witht he cookie name, not the value....
sburjan - (16:32): I cleared all the cookies .. andnow it perfectly works
vmassol - (16:33): sure but that doesn't prove there isn't a pb
sburjan - (16:33): i used around 7 snapshots without clearing nothing in the browser
sburjan - (16:33): what's the expiration time of the cookie ?
sburjan - (16:34): well.. I'll try to reproduce that error .. maybe 2 different versions of xwiki using a cookie created by another version
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vmassol - (16:39): ok
vmassol - (16:39): I couldn't find a pb after a cursory look at the code
sburjan - (16:41): i'm failing to reproduce
sburjan - (16:41): (the problem)
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vmassol - (18:43): …. as your name suggests....
vmassol - (18:43): :)
vmassol - (18:43): (I hope it's not your real name :))
vmassol - (18:44): ah no it's not…. pfeww…. almost made a blunder
vmassol - (18:47): anyone good in threading here? I don't understand something…..
vmassol - (18:48): tmortagne1: you busy?
tmortagne1 - (18:48): vmassol: always :)
vmassol - (18:48): (I see you're doing your 20% time while waiting for sergiu to wake up…..)
tmortagne1 - (18:48): :)
tmortagne1 - (18:48): shoot
vmassol - (18:48): tmortagne1: in case you can spare a few minutes, you could connect on skype
vmassol - (18:48): might be easier
tmortagne1 - (18:48): sine i'm discovered
vmassol - (18:48): :)
tmortagne1 - (18:48): ha i'm not on skype ?
tmortagne1 - (18:49): indeed it crashed
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DSpair - (21:05): Uhhhggg. . . AT&T had a card go bad in one of their backbone switches and it has taken down our entire North America WAN.... Our company is losing about $200k every 10 minutes right now.
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CalebJamesDeLisl - (00:51): It returns a list. You can use a for loop like: for (String name : results) {
DSpair - (00:52): OK, thanks!
DSpair - (00:55): OK, I tried to run my first query and I got "Failed to locate Script Service [query]"
DSpair - (00:55): Back to the docs.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (01:29): What was the command? Ping me when you have questions because I'm not always looking at irc.
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CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:13): I had a crazy idea, maybe all code should start out messy. If code starts out as one big method, then as it grows it gets broken off into other methods, then they become inner classes and finally the classes are promoted to .java files, no code ends up in production without multiple revisions and having been used, revised and used again.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:15): Code which has seen real use and been revised is less likely to have extension points which later on prove useless.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:17): Also if a coder doesn't think about extensibility and cleanliness until after the first prototype runs, the space of time between the eureka moment and running code is shorter.
vmassol - (09:20): I wouldn't like that…. :)
vmassol - (09:21): But
vmassol - (09:21): components are there to hide implementation details
vmassol - (09:21): and anything in the internal package is internal
vmassol - (09:21): so you're just talking about putting stuff internally first before exposing it
vmassol - (09:21): and this I agree
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:22): I write a lot of messy code, it never leaves my computer.
vmassol - (09:22): it's surely safer to open apis on need basis rather than too early
vmassol - (09:22): CalebJamesDeLisl: you can commit it in the sandbox :)
vmassol - (09:22): if you want to see messy code look at xwiki-core
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:22): I did :)
vmassol - (09:22): and look at how hard it is to maintain/evolve it
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:23): Something I noticed in xwiki-core was there were extension points which were never used so it's clear that the developer _tried_ to do it right.
vmassol - (09:24): there are ad-hoc extensions points everywhere
vmassol - (09:24): with hacks over hacks
vmassol - (09:24): to provide extensibility
vmassol - (09:24): and to take care of all use cases
vmassol - (09:24): but *without* having done any refactoring
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:24): I agree with you about apis, they are difficult to deal with.
vmassol - (09:24): as a consequence it's a big ball of mud
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:24): Yes, refactoring is key.
vmassol - (09:25): the key is the refactoring
vmassol - (09:25): yep
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:25): I am partial to the concept of spiral development I guess.
vmassol - (09:25): I also like iterative dev
vmassol - (09:26): but I don't see it as the opposite of clean dev
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:27): Well I see the problem with clean from the start development is that you don't know what you will need later so the developer tries to guess where extension points will be needed.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:28): My whole concept breaks down when multiple developers are working on the same piece of code (xwiki-core) because they are all afraid of breaking something.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:31): Something I find neat is how community development leads to modularity if for no other reason because nobody wants to break other people's code.
vmassol - (09:31): it's never clean from the start
vmassol - (09:31): but it can be thought out at a minimum level
vmassol - (09:31): you'll make mistakes anyway
vmassol - (09:32): but having cleaniness at heart will lead to better solution when you refactor the second time
vmassol - (09:32): and more importantly
vmassol - (09:32): it allows others to participate
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:33): Others are pretty well locked out until the code has undergone a few iterations.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:33): (in my model)
sburjan - (09:39): hello vmassol
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CalebJamesDeLisl - (09:49): Now that Dirtree has some semblance of stability, I'm doing stuff that I was putting off because it was a pain before. This is great. Now all I have to do is shorten the build time for XE.
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vmassol - (09:58): CalebJamesDeLisl: once you have something stable and you're happy with it, you could send a mail explaining it to others and see where to take it from there, maybe?
vmassol - (09:59): got to disconnect for 1 mn, brb
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silviar - (10:02): Hi! I have an issue if someone has a bit of time to look at it. I've added an application icon to the new invitation page http://code.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Applications/InvitationApplication; The issue is the icon will not show up in the bundled applications list on the Enterprise Features page http://enterprise.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Main/Features
silviar - (10:02): I think this has something to do with the fact that the new app page is in 2.0 Syntax
silviar - (10:02): as opposed to the other pages which are still in 1.0
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:03): Hmm. let me take a look. I wrote it.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:03): Nice icon.
silviar - (10:03): thanks
vmassol - (10:04): the image is missing the url for some reason
vmassol - (10:04): silviar: you have invitation.png
vmassol - (10:04): instead of the full url
vmassol - (10:04): let me check the other pages
vmassol - (10:05): yes that's why
vmassol - (10:05): you need a URL
vmassol - (10:05): I don't know if it's supported but it should be computed with velocity ideally
vmassol - (10:05): let me check if it works
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:06): Ahh yes, when I wrote the 2.0 version I was making it "so easy" by appending the content to "attack:"
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:06): s/attack:/attach:
silviar - (10:06): i've added the url, but the problem persists
silviar - (10:07): last time i fixed this by changing the page to 1.0 syntax for the annotations app page
vmassol - (10:07): silviar: nope
vmassol - (10:07): :)
vmassol - (10:07): it's fixed
vmassol - (10:07): it's just that this page has a cache
silviar - (10:07): ok :)
silviar - (10:07): so that was it
vmassol - (10:07): to refresh pages with a cache you need to suffix the url with ?refresh=1
silviar - (10:07): thanks
vmassol - (10:08): CalebJamesDeLisl: hmmm not much we can do to prevent having to put a full URL right now
vmassol - (10:08): since attach will only support absolute URL FTM
vmassol - (10:08): so using $xwiki.getDocument(…).getURL(…) will not work
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:09): I think the fix is going to break the other page until someone changes the classSheet
vmassol - (10:09): silviar: don't change pages to 1.0 syntax!
vmassol - (10:10): we want the opposite :)
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:10): Ok, I used "image:" so it still works with the full URL. Good.
silviar - (10:11): yes, i know :)
sburjan - (10:12): Does anybody have any Idea when the multilanguage problem will be fixed ? the one that shows all available languages even if the user enabled 3
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:13): hah, I capitalize Idea too.
vmassol - (10:13): sburjan: nobody expressed interest so far in fixing this AFAIK
vmassol - (10:15): CalebJamesDeLisl: some failing tests for you: http://hudson.xwiki.org/job/xwiki-product-enterprise-tests/com.xpn.xwiki.products$xwiki-enterprise-test-ui/990/testReport/
vmassol - (10:15): hmm sergiu hasn't fixed the object editor yet
vmassol - (10:15): :(
vmassol - (10:16): another day lost for the release
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:16): That looks like the flicker we were talking about. Seems to be disrupting the state.
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tmortagne - (10:16): vmassol: yep i can't see him connected since he said he would fix them
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:17): Maybe I can try to detect a page load.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:17): Broken fiber strikes at the worst moments...
vmassol - (10:18): broken fiber is better than no fiber at all! :)
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:18): I don't have any fiber but I live in the woods and when a fiber breaks nobody reports it for a week.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:18): (the backhaul fiber for the town)
tmortagne - (10:19): vmassol: i reduced the validity test to only inline style related failures that will can't be easily fixed without some refactoring but are very minor so that would be ok for the release
vmassol - (10:20): tmortagne: ok, what's the plan after the release? We enable them again? We'll need to decide who fixes them
sburjan - (10:20): how can a fiber break ?
vmassol - (10:20): sburjan: put an elephant on it
vmassol - (10:20): :)
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:21): or a tree branch. Or an incompetent backhoe operator.
tmortagne - (10:21): vmassol: i don't plan to disable them, they should be blocker for the RC
sburjan - (10:21): i know optic-fiber is buried
vmassol - (10:21): tmortagne: oh ok, I understood wrongly your message
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:21): Not in my town, it runs along the phone lines.
sburjan - (10:22): i understand
tmortagne - (10:22): vmassol: i said it's ok to release a milestone with them because they are minor but i don't need to disable anything to release
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:22): In my town you can't dig 6 inches without hitting a rock.
sburjan - (10:23): where do you live ?
tmortagne - (10:23): there is only one that will probably impossible to fix and that we will disable i guess: that's the incitation one that needs to be inline because of mails
CalebJamesDeLisl - (10:23): woods
sburjan - (10:28): vmassol : when you have 5 minutes to finish the yesterday's topic please tell me :)
vmassol - (10:29): sburjan: don't wait for me
vmassol - (10:29): just ask your questions
vmassol - (10:29): but don't ask them to me
vmassol - (10:29): ask them to the community
vmassol - (10:29): whoever is free and has the answer will answer
sburjan - (10:29): ok. i'll try to be as short as possible. This is a question for everybody anyway.
vmassol - (10:30): just to be clear, there's nobody in charge of xwiki.org
vmassol - (10:30): I'm not in charge for ex
sburjan - (10:30): We have some portion of documentation that aren;t accessible from nowhere. There are certain pages that only accessible if you know the URL, but from the interface they are inaccessible.
sburjan - (10:31): i know, but you're one of the few who actually respond to my dilemmas
sburjan - (10:31): *isn't
vmassol - (10:31): sure but I'd like others to answer too
sburjan - (10:31): me too
vmassol - (10:31): so if you ping me nobody else will answer
vmassol - (10:31): :)
sburjan - (10:31): :)
vmassol - (10:32): what page? can you give an ex?
sburjan - (10:32): now
sburjan - (10:32): http://code.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Applications/WatchlistApplication
sburjan - (10:32): go to : Viewing the elements in your watchlist
sburjan - (10:32): on the bottom
sburjan - (10:32): you'll see there a screenshot with Remove from watchlist
sburjan - (10:33): that screen isn;t accessible from nowhere, but only if you know the URL
vmassol - (10:33): I think that screenshot is old now
vmassol - (10:33): since the watchlist is now in the user's profile
vmassol - (10:33): no?
sburjan - (10:33): but the "interface" is still there
sburjan - (10:33): yes
tmortagne - (10:33): sburjan: are you sure ? wathlist is supposed to be accessible in user profile
sburjan - (10:33): it is accessible from user profile
sburjan - (10:34): but you can.t delete nothing from there
vmassol - (10:34): sburjan: the UI is different now so the image will need to be updated
sburjan - (10:34): onlyUNwatch
vmassol - (10:34): sburjan: indeed it's a bug
vmassol - (10:34): jvdrean: any idea?
vmassol - (10:34): (jvdrean is the one who did it)
sburjan - (10:34): it's not a bug.. we changed the UI in thea meantime.. but forgot to actually delete the old functionality
vmassol - (10:34): entering call now, bbl
sburjan - (10:34): okay
sburjan - (10:35): so as far as I see, nowdays we don't telede the watch on a space, page, wiki, we click on the unwatch button
tmortagne - (10:35): sburjan: something that should not be here is a bug ;)
sburjan - (10:35): and this oldscreen + still existingfunctionality has remained
sburjan - (10:39): I mean... it's like we have multiple UI's .. but only one of them is viewable, the others are like hidden easter eggs :)
sburjan - (10:40): the problem would be that is they will coexist .. maybe they could break functionality and become some sort of exploits
sburjan - (10:40): and can't be found when testing
tmortagne - (10:41): sburjan: again this does not looks like something done on purpose and everyone agree that it's bad to have old lost UIs duplicating new UIs
tmortagne - (10:43): sburjan: jvdrean is looking at it (can't answer right now)
jvdrean - (10:44): looking at it, indeed there's a page that should have been removed a while ago
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jvdrean - (10:48): lucaa: looks like the annotations menu entry doesn't like the use of the watch entry next to it
lucaa - (10:48): hi jvdrean
lucaa - (10:49): it's the other way around :) watch menu is refreshing the whole menu when it's changed
sburjan - (10:49): okay, so I should issue a Major bug on JIRA ?
jvdrean - (10:49): is there a jira about this ?
jvdrean - (10:49): sburjan: I'll handle it
lucaa - (10:49): what bug are you referring?
sburjan - (10:49): okay jvdrean
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sburjan - (10:52): okay. so I have a go to remove the documentation that reffers to the lost UI ?
jvdrean - (10:53): sburjan: yes please, the 'Viewing the elements in your watchlist' paragraph must be removed
sburjan - (10:54): ps: this is present also on xwiki.org
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CalebJamesDeLisl - (11:05): So are there any opinions on whether the invitation app should be linked from other places and if so where?
CalebJamesDeLisl - (11:05): On the one hand, if it's not set up then linking it to the user pages or some place will confuse users when it doesn't work.
silviar - (11:06): jvdrean: I actually found the watchlist hidden page while fixing the notifications page on xwiki.org, otherwise we may not have noticed it; for the watch & annotations issue i filed this bug some time ago XAANNOTATIONS-9 ; feel free to move it to watchlist app if you think that's where it should go
CalebJamesDeLisl - (11:07): On the other hand, that's the way the watchlist app works and it's linked from the user pages even if it doesn't work.
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jvdrean - (11:09): CalebJamesDeLisl: wdym?
CalebJamesDeLisl - (11:09): If no mail relay is set up, users can still access the watchlist.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (11:10): Asking is that how invitation should be (see post before Silvia's)
jvdrean - (11:10): (computer slow has hell, I didn't see your previous messages at first)
CalebJamesDeLisl - (11:12): I could put it in the user dropdown menu under profile, preferences, watchlist.
sburjan - (11:13): CalebJamesDeLisl, : have you separeted failed messages from the other ?
CalebJamesDeLisl - (11:13): Nah, getting there...
CalebJamesDeLisl - (11:14): Seems logical to separate accepted messages, and declined messages etc. So it will be a redesign of the page.
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CalebJamesDeLisl - (11:22): How did saving ram in the velocity macros go? Were any changes made to the cache?
tmortagne - (11:29): CalebJamesDeLisl: vmassol fixed it, the change is that the cache is cleaned at the end of the page rendering process now
CalebJamesDeLisl - (11:30): So it doesn't clean when #includeForm is called?
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tmortagne - (11:32): no
tmortagne - (11:32): (no it does not)
sburjan - (11:42): who created the ColorTheme App ?
sburjan - (11:43): I have a question. I am able to change the ColorTheme from the Administration Panel, but I can;t change the ColorTheme from AdministerSpace. The field isn't there anymore. Is this normal behaviour ?
sburjan - (11:45): I can change the skin for a space (eg. put Toucan) .. so I should be able to change ColorThemes in Colibri too
tmortagne - (11:47): sburjan: i think it's not supported at space level or something
sburjan - (11:47): so only skin change is supported at space level ?
sburjan - (11:48): okay
sburjan - (11:49): another issue is .. does XWiki support user level skin change ? I found a document that states this, but I am unable to do ti
tmortagne - (11:49): (not 100% sure, sdumitriu would know better)
sburjan - (11:49): *i
sburjan - (11:49): okay
tmortagne - (11:49): user level skin change is not supported no AFAIK
sburjan - (11:50): thanks. I'll correct the docs
tmortagne - (11:50): (but again not the expert, simply never heard of that)
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CalebJamesDeLisl - (12:20): What can you do with XWQL that you can't to with hibernate?
tmortagne - (12:46): CalebJamesDeLisl: most important thing is that you write query supposedly independent from the storage
tmortagne - (12:47): now i doubt you can do things with XWQL impossible with hibernate, since the query is converted to hibernate query
CalebJamesDeLisl - (12:47): Been playing with it a little, I can write most of the hql language into the xwql parser so I'm not sure if that's a realistic expectation.
tmortagne - (12:47): CalebJamesDeLisl: artem tested XWQL with JCR
tmortagne - (12:48): which is completely different
CalebJamesDeLisl - (12:48): I would be +1 for it if there was a nice way to (for instance) get an object property value.
tmortagne - (12:48): CalebJamesDeLisl: i don't know XWQL very well but it's supposed to be easier to write than hql
tmortagne - (12:49): things you probably can't do with XWQL are join i guess
vmassol - (12:49): tmortagne: really?
CalebJamesDeLisl - (12:49): The problem with JCR testing is proving that you can't craft an xql query which will not work on jcr.
vmassol - (12:49): why not?
CalebJamesDeLisl - (12:50): No I just did a join.
vmassol - (12:50): XWQL is a superset of JPQL
vmassol - (12:50): so all JPQL stuffare supported
tmortagne - (12:50): vmassol: no idea, it's just that it's generally the last thing supported and i don't think JCR support that
vmassol - (12:50): it's not JCR
vmassol - (12:50): this is not JCR
tmortagne - (12:50): vmassol: i know
tmortagne - (12:50): it's not what i said
vmassol - (12:50): "things you probably can't do with XWQL are join i guess"
vmassol - (12:50): was just answerng to that
tmortagne - (12:50): there is an JCR based imprementation
tmortagne - (12:50): which is supposed to support XWQL
vmassol - (12:51): really?
vmassol - (12:51): I didn't know that
tmortagne - (12:51): yes and you did not understand what i said
tmortagne - (12:51): that was one of the main goal
tmortagne - (12:51): having a common language for several implementations
tmortagne - (12:52): now i don't know how far artem could go on JCR implementation
CalebJamesDeLisl - (12:52): What happens if users write queries (say for instance with joins) and then we switch to jcr and those queries break because fundamentally they are HQL?
tmortagne - (12:52): CalebJamesDeLisl: i'm not even sure it's not supported by JCR but i think i remember something about that
tmortagne - (12:53): but i gues if we have time and workforce for it in that case we would have to emulate
CalebJamesDeLisl - (12:54): I see no way of proving that every XWQL->HQL query will work with XWQL->JCR.
vmassol - (12:54): JCR has its own query API
vmassol - (12:54): and JCR implementation have to support some query languages
vmassol - (12:54): xpath, sql in jcr 2.0
vmassol - (12:55): now some JCR implementation should allow you to plug your own language implementation
vmassol - (12:55): but this remains to be seen
vmassol - (12:55): I couldn't find out how to do that easily with jackrabit for ex
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vmassol - (12:55): (I didn't look too long though, was just looking for a way to replace the jackrabbit query engine with ours)
CalebJamesDeLisl - (12:56): Another complaint about XWQL is the error messages. "expecting from, id"
tmortagne - (12:57): AFAICS we only have XWQLtoHQLTranslator for now
CalebJamesDeLisl - (12:58): So it's not even proven that XWQL _can_ be translated to JCR.
tmortagne - (12:58): so no JCR support
tmortagne - (12:59): i think that's why i remember something about Artem waiting for JCR2
CalebJamesDeLisl - (12:59): I like the idea of an XWiki query manager.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (13:01): IMO the perfect query manager would take the place of hibernate or jcr and interface with jdbc.
vmassol - (13:01): CalebJamesDeLisl: you mean a XWIKI JCR query manager?
vmassol - (13:02): (because otherwise we already have a xwiki query manager)
CalebJamesDeLisl - (13:03): I am worried that jcr would not perform well. Everything in one table, sounds like bad news.
vmassol - (13:03): JCR doesn't say that.It depends on implementations
vmassol - (13:03): the pb with a xwiki jcr query manager is that the JCR specs doesn't say anything about plugging your own implementation
vmassol - (13:04): CalebJamesDeLisl: there are 2 differents things to understand
vmassol - (13:04): 1) using the JCR API
vmassol - (13:04): 2) using an existing JCR implementation
CalebJamesDeLisl - (13:04): What are the advantages of JCR?
vmassol - (13:04): your code is independent of the underlying storage and standard
vmassol - (13:04): standard = you can change the underlying engine
CalebJamesDeLisl - (13:05): Well actually it's dependent on JCR standard.
vmassol - (13:05): JCR is a standard and it's generic for any content app
tmortagne - (13:05): I guess that's the mail that made me remember something about JCR 2/query manager: http://markmail.org/message/o77ki3skmmpvpjgs
CalebJamesDeLisl - (13:06): And some vendors will add optional features which we must avoid in order to be compatable, just like SQL.
vmassol - (13:06): CalebJamesDeLisl: you really need to have a look at what JCR
vmassol - (13:06): provides
vmassol - (13:06): it's 100 times better than what we ahve
vmassol - (13:07): I started listed the advantages for us on the new model design page
vmassol - (13:07): and I'm only talking about standard jcr
vmassol - (13:07): not anything optional
CalebJamesDeLisl - (13:07): I read up on it a bit. The text was talking about the choice between jcr and subversion which is not very encouraging from a performance perspective.
vmassol - (13:07): JCR is like JDBC if you prefer
vmassol - (13:08): before JDBC you could still DB queries
vmassol - (13:08): s/Still/still do/
vmassol - (13:08): I think I put some links in the deisng page
CalebJamesDeLisl - (13:08): Without jdbc each db would need a different driver api correct?
vmassol - (13:09): yes
vmassol - (13:09): lunch time!
CalebJamesDeLisl - (13:09): coffee time.
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vmassol - (13:31): still no sergiu….
vmassol - (13:37): guys seems there's a new version of selenium2
vmassol - (13:37): http://repo2.maven.org/maven2/org/seleniumhq/selenium/selenium/2.0a4/
vmassol - (13:38): I'm proposing to upgrade
vmassol - (13:38): ok?
tmortagne - (13:38): +1
vmassol - (13:38): I'll run some tests locally with it first
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vmassol - (13:45): I still get errors…. our tests are really bad I think since I always get lots of errors when I execute them locally
vmassol - (13:45): several are missing setting up preconditions
vmassol - (13:47): + even more important the flickering
vmassol - (13:48): I think this is not correct:
vmassol - (13:48): public void clickSaveAndContinue()
vmassol - (13:48): {
vmassol - (13:48): saveandcontinue.click();
vmassol - (13:48): }
vmassol - (13:48): we need to wait for the save to have been done I think
vmassol - (13:48): this is one causing flickering
vmassol - (13:48): I'll try to fix it
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DSpair - (13:54): Good morning all.
DSpair - (13:55): Quick question. I created a new class called "Circuit". I added several object of that class type to a document. I then added a livetable to that document and got the following message and only one row of results : The environment prevents the table to load data.
DSpair - (13:56): Wait one, I found a mailing list post about this error.
DSpair - (14:00): OK, I imported the updated version of LiveTable application and now I don't get an error, but I also don't get any data displayed.
vmassol - (14:13): js guys, any idea why the following doesn't work for save&continue:
vmassol - (14:13): waitUntilElementIsVisible(By.xpath("//div[@class='xnotification-done' and text()='Saved'"));
vmassol - (14:13): I also tried with:
vmassol - (14:13): waitUntilElementIsVisible(By.xpath("//div[@class='xnotification-done']"));
vmassol - (14:17): this one seems to work though:
vmassol - (14:17): waitUntilElementIsVisible(By.className("xnotification-done"));
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:19): you can do that in an xpath?
vmassol - (14:19): CalebJamesDeLisl: what part?
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:20): and text()... looks wrong
vmassol - (14:20): yes that one might not work
vmassol - (14:20): I wasn't sure of myself
vmassol - (14:20): but the other one should have worked
vmassol - (14:20): no?
vmassol - (14:20): unless it's not a div
vmassol - (14:20): but the js source seems to suggest it is
vmassol - (14:20): this.element = new Element("div", {"class" : "xnotification xnotification-" + this.type}).update(this.text);
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:21): Also if it's multiple class names.
vmassol - (14:21): hmm right
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:21): class="class1 class2"
vmassol - (14:21): that might be it
vmassol - (14:21): trying
vmassol - (14:22): indeed
vmassol - (14:22): waitUntilElementIsVisible(By.xpath("//div[contains(@class,'xnotification-done')]"));
vmassol - (14:22): works
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:22): hmm, didn't know about that one.
vmassol - (14:22): btw
vmassol - (14:23): this works too now
vmassol - (14:23): waitUntilElementIsVisible(By.xpath("//div[contains(@class,'xnotification-done') and text()='Saved']"));
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:23): Interesting. I must have missed the lower half of the xpath spec.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:25): I read your page about JCR. Versioning is very nice. Still no language integration of queries, unfortunately.
vmassol - (14:26): regarding xpath
vmassol - (14:26): I was told to avoid it as much as possible in selenium2
vmassol - (14:26): because the xpath engine on IE is awfully slow
vmassol - (14:26): at some point we might want to replace them with other chained By
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:27): I have been avoiding xpath because it just seems like it would be slow. Are we planning IE testing?
vmassol - (14:27): re IE yes
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:28): Good. Releasing with IE bugs was not cool.
vmassol - (14:28): CalebJamesDeLisl: is that what you mean: http://www.day.com/specs/jcr/2.0/6_Query.html ?
vmassol - (14:28): JCR-JQOM
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:29): Query createQuery(java.lang.String statement, java.lang.String language)
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:30): Same old query method = same old "select something where this = '" + sqlInjection + "'";
vmassol - (14:30): I don't read it this way
vmassol - (14:30): "JCR-JQOM (JCR Java Query Object Model), which expresses a query as a tree of Java objects."
vmassol - (14:32): ah here's an ex:
vmassol - (14:32): http://dev.day.com/discussion-groups/content/lists/cq-google/2010-03/2010-03-24__day_communique_CQ5_3_how_to_create_queries_with_JQOM_Thomas_Amsler.html/4?sort=date&q=jcr
vmassol - (14:33): hmm not very good ex
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:35): This looks promising: http://www.day.com/maven/javax.jcr/javadocs/jcr-2.0/index.html
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:36): No this http://www.day.com/maven/javax.jcr/javadocs/jcr-2.0/javax/jcr/query/qom/package-summary.html
vmassol - (14:36): yes
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:37): I still want to see a real query. Linq is ok but not that intuitive.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:38): Seen more broken websites looking for this than in the past week.
vmassol - (14:41): ok 9 more false positives tests to fix….
vmassol - (14:41): CalebJamesDeLisl: are you fixing this one:
vmassol - (14:41): java.lang.AssertionError: LiveValidation did not show a failure message but clicking on the register button did.
vmassol - (14:41): ?
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:41): I'm not sure what to do with that.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:42): Stop testing liveValidation?
vmassol - (14:42): make it work?
DSpair - (14:42): LOL
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:42): return true; ;)
vmassol - (14:42): these are failing locally for me: http://tinycoke.com/_6rsuAVrtncELU/screen_shot_2010-06-24_at_2.41.55_pm.png
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:43): I havn't seen that many fail on my machine.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:44): running...
vmassol - (14:44): I have a build from yesterday morning I think
DSpair - (14:46): Wanted to let you know, in the next few days I will have completed my new application for XWiki. It's called InfrastructureBackup and it allows you to add a list of Cisco/HP/Nortel/etc... devices which it will then automatically log into via telnet/SSH and capture the running configuration and back it up as an attachment.
DSpair - (14:46): I'll submit it for public use to wherever you would like me to put it.
sburjan - (14:46): guys, who crafted the PhotoAlbum App ?
DSpair - (14:46): I should say "I'll have finished the first version"
florinciu - (14:47): sburjan: JV and Jerome I think
DSpair - (14:48): Right now it uses ExpectJ and calls to "exec()" to run local copies of ssh/telnet. The next version I will integrate Jsch for SSH and use sockets for Telnet.
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:48): That's great! Applications go on code.xwiki.org
tmortagne - (14:50): CalebJamesDeLisl: you can close XAADMINISTRATION-140 since there is no XHTML validity issues in admin app anymore
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:51): Yes, thanks for pointing that out. Should I assign you?
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:52): Actually we all put some work into that one.
tmortagne - (14:52): CalebJamesDeLisl: your are the only one having done commit associated to this issue ;)
tmortagne - (14:52): assign to you
CalebJamesDeLisl - (14:52): Ok, credit I can take.
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tmortagne - (14:56): CalebJamesDeLisl: same for http://jira.xwiki.org/jira/browse/XAADMINISTRATION-139
DSpair - (14:59): I just downloaded XEclipse and it won't run. Is the Linux version only good on 32bit?
CalebJamesDeLisl - (15:00): Hmm I still see a few failures.
tmortagne - (15:00): CalebJamesDeLisl: not on admin app
tmortagne - (15:00): let me re-check
tmortagne - (15:00): CalebJamesDeLisl: there is annotation, invitation and editors
tmortagne - (15:01): so nothing related to xwiki-application-administration project
CalebJamesDeLisl - (15:01): I see so that's because you changed the rules?
tmortagne - (15:02): what rules are you talking about ?
tmortagne - (15:02): i fixed lots of test (and remove PanelWyzard test) but i did not changed anything
CalebJamesDeLisl - (15:02): Ok.
tmortagne - (15:03): s/fixed lots of test/fixed lots of failure/
CalebJamesDeLisl - (15:06): Did you commit on any issue when you fixed the tests?
tmortagne - (15:07): CalebJamesDeLisl: was generally "[misc] Fix Dutch Web Guidelines validity issues" i was a bit lazy on that but i mostly fixed templates if i remember well, if i fixed admin app page it was a very few
tmortagne - (15:08): (and "[misc] Fix XHTML validity issues")
CalebJamesDeLisl - (15:08): Hmm, no commits on that issue and it's fixed.
tmortagne - (15:08): checking
tmortagne - (15:09): CalebJamesDeLisl: maybe you fixed them in some other committs
tmortagne - (15:10): i don't see any commit from me on admin app since the previous release
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CalebJamesDeLisl - (15:10): I guess I'll call it a dupe of the XHTML issue.
tmortagne - (15:11): yep maybe you fixed theses issue with the XHTML issues yes
tmortagne - (15:11): CalebJamesDeLisl: XAADMINISTRATION-149
tmortagne - (15:12): that was a XHTML issue too
tmortagne - (15:12): so you probably committed in theses one
CalebJamesDeLisl - (15:12): Ahh, thanks.
tmortagne - (15:12): anyway, if there was anything you fixed it ;)
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sburjan - (16:08): I get this warning in the console when running the latest snapshot
sburjan - (16:08): 2010-06-24 17:03:22,814 [http://localhost:8080/xwiki/bin/edit/UNREGISTEREDuserSPACE/WebHome?parent=&template=&title=UNREGISTEREDuserSPACE] WARN internal.DefaultVelocityEngine - Deprecated usage of getter [com.xpn.xwiki.api.Document.getSyntaxId] in /templates/macros.vm@2341,54
sburjan - (16:08): I only created a new space
vmassol - (16:08): sburjan: we're fixing those, this is a just a warning so don't worry
sburjan - (16:09): I;m worried about everything that looks a bit suspicious
vmassol - (16:09): sburjan: yes that's good
sburjan - (16:10): so these warns will be fixed in M2 ?
vmassol - (16:10): yes
sburjan - (16:10): okay
sburjan - (16:11): also I get A LOT of these when logging off/in
sburjan - (16:11): 2010-06-24 17:10:41.045::WARN: java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: Cookie name "XWiki.Admin_Panels.Recently Modified" is a reserved token
vmassol - (16:11): that one isn't normal
vmassol - (16:11): never seen it
sburjan - (16:12): these aren't logged in xwiki.log
sburjan - (16:12): they are spat directly in the terminal
vmassol - (16:13): whatever goes on the terminal also go in xwiki.log
vmassol - (16:14): (unless you've modified the default logging config but I doubt that)
vmassol - (16:14): ah maybe they're not coming from xwiki
sburjan - (16:14): oddly, these aren't in my xwiki.log . running latest snapshot, default all
vmassol - (16:14): in which case they'll go in other log files
vmassol - (16:15): hmm
vmassol - (16:15): another option is that whoever sends those don't use the xwiki log system
vmassol - (16:15): you don't have more details?
sburjan - (16:16): well .. in order to reproduce
sburjan - (16:16): I start either start_xwiki.sh or start_xwiki_debug.sh ...
sburjan - (16:17): click on Run In Terminal
sburjan - (16:17): so I get a terminal windows opened as long as xwikis erver is running
sburjan - (16:17): and this is the place where I get these
vmassol - (16:17): anyway that's not the issue
vmassol - (16:17): how do I reproduce?
sburjan - (16:18): how I said above
sburjan - (16:18): i get a few when logging in, a few when logging out
vmassol - (16:18): so you get those at startup even when you don't touch the xwiki app?
sburjan - (16:18): let me try
vmassol - (16:18): ahah
vmassol - (16:18): so you log in
vmassol - (16:18): you didn't say that before
sburjan - (16:18): i log in
vmassol - (16:19): can you verify?
vmassol - (16:19): that you get them all the time
sburjan - (16:19): when starting xwiki clean.. without touching nothing, not even a refresh I don't get it
vmassol - (16:19): I don't get why we're putting the name of a page in a cookie though
sburjan - (16:19): I get it when simply refreshing the page
sburjan - (16:20): again when hitting the log In button
sburjan - (16:20): again when hitting the Log out button
sburjan - (16:20): i have a clue why we do that
vmassol - (16:20): to redirect back to the page after logging?
sburjan - (16:21): because when you log off, i saw that xwiki has the tendency to leavy you on the same page you were on when you hit logoff, instead ofredirecting to the main page
sburjan - (16:21): yes
sburjan - (16:21): exactly
sburjan - (16:21): but i'm not a tech guy yet, so I don;t know what happens before
vmassol - (16:21): what servlet container are you using, jetty?
sburjan - (16:21): yes, standard jetty, latest snapshot take from mave.xwiki.org ...
sburjan - (16:21): *taken
sburjan - (16:22): these lines aren'tsaved in xwiki.log
sburjan - (16:22): i triple checked
sburjan - (16:23): what could I do more in order to help figure it out ?
vmassol - (16:23): nothing FTM
vmassol - (16:23): except report it
vmassol - (16:23): in jira
vmassol - (16:25): it's possible sergiu introduced the pb in rev 28709
sburjan - (16:25): wait till silviar confirms too
vmassol - (16:25): when fixing "XWIKI-5156: Session cookies are not marked as HttpOnly"
vmassol - (16:26): maybe response.addCookie was escaping chars
vmassol - (16:26): while the new method he's used odesn't
sburjan - (16:27): maybe my browser or cache or cookies have something
sburjan - (16:27): let me cleamall
sburjan - (16:30): it was my browser's cookies
sburjan - (16:30): something messed them up. I officially apologize
vmassol - (16:31): yes sergiu's code does use quoted string:
vmassol - (16:32): cookieValue.append("\"" + cookie.getValue() + "\"");
vmassol - (16:32): so special chars hsould be ok
vmassol - (16:32): I still odn't understand how you could have such invalid cookies
sburjan - (16:32): i'm special :)
vmassol - (16:32): seems the pb is witht he cookie name, not the value....
sburjan - (16:32): I cleared all the cookies .. andnow it perfectly works
vmassol - (16:33): sure but that doesn't prove there isn't a pb
sburjan - (16:33): i used around 7 snapshots without clearing nothing in the browser
sburjan - (16:33): what's the expiration time of the cookie ?
sburjan - (16:34): well.. I'll try to reproduce that error .. maybe 2 different versions of xwiki using a cookie created by another version
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vmassol - (16:39): ok
vmassol - (16:39): I couldn't find a pb after a cursory look at the code
sburjan - (16:41): i'm failing to reproduce
sburjan - (16:41): (the problem)
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vmassol - (18:43): …. as your name suggests....
vmassol - (18:43): :)
vmassol - (18:43): (I hope it's not your real name :))
vmassol - (18:44): ah no it's not…. pfeww…. almost made a blunder
vmassol - (18:47): anyone good in threading here? I don't understand something…..
vmassol - (18:48): tmortagne1: you busy?
tmortagne1 - (18:48): vmassol: always :)
vmassol - (18:48): (I see you're doing your 20% time while waiting for sergiu to wake up…..)
tmortagne1 - (18:48): :)
tmortagne1 - (18:48): shoot
vmassol - (18:48): tmortagne1: in case you can spare a few minutes, you could connect on skype
vmassol - (18:48): might be easier
tmortagne1 - (18:48): sine i'm discovered
vmassol - (18:48): :)
tmortagne1 - (18:48): ha i'm not on skype ?
tmortagne1 - (18:49): indeed it crashed
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DSpair - (21:05): Uhhhggg. . . AT&T had a card go bad in one of their backbone switches and it has taken down our entire North America WAN.... Our company is losing about $200k every 10 minutes right now.
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